Author Topic: Vevkjerring  (Read 5151 times)

Offline Tomas Husdal

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Vevkjerring
« on: September 27, 2012, 06:30:03 PM »
Ikke helt sikker på denne vevkjerringa fra Bodø. Kjører nøkkelen til Stol http://www.entomologi.no/journals/tabell/pdf/Norske_Insekttabeller_16.pdf og havner i Leiobuninae (tenner på palpekloa - punkt 20).
Blir så usikker på om dette er Nelima gothica eller en Leiobunum (og da L. rupestre). Øyetuberkelen har hår, men jeg ser ingen dentikler. Leiobunum skal ha helt glatt øyetuberkel... Finner heller ingen dentikler på coxae.

Harald, du har funnet Nelima gothica tidligere. Hva tror du?

Tomas

Offline Tomas Husdal

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #1 on: September 27, 2012, 06:32:14 PM »
Hår på øyetuberkel...

Leste på et nettsted at disse mørke flekkene på coxae er karakteristisk for Nelima gothica...

Tomas

Offline H. Løvbrekke

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #2 on: September 27, 2012, 07:33:41 PM »

Tomas

Nå er jeg ikke så godt inne i dette, men tror ikke det er Nelima gothica. Den er ikke så sterkt mønstret og den er mer oppblåst.

-Harald

Offline Tomas Husdal

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2012, 11:21:58 AM »
Nei, får ikke denne til å stemme helt. Har du forresten epostadressen til Ingvar Stol?

Tomas

Offline Lars Friman

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2014, 02:46:48 PM »
Moin,
this one is, I quess, Leiobunum tisciae (f), because of the U-shape
Opisthosome figure.
Lars Friman

see: Uddström et al. (2013) Opiliones newto Finnland. - Memoranda Soc. Fauna Flora Fennica 89, 2013

page 3:

Changes to the checklist due to misidentifications

"Leiobunum tisciae Avram, 1968 has been systematically misidentified as Leiobunum rupestre
(Herbst, 1799). Lars Friman was the first to notice the misidentification and he contacted us.
All Leiobunum specimens we have checked so far have turned out Leiobunum tisciae (from the
collections of the Zoological Museum of Finnish Museum of Natural History, University of Helsinki,
of the Zoological Museum, University of Turku, and our own collections from Åland and
southern coast of Finland). It seems very unlikely that Leiobunum rupestre occurs in Finland."

Offline Tomas Husdal

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2014, 10:15:01 AM »
Thanks for the comment, Lars (and welcome to this forum).

How can we be sure? Are there other characters, or do you know a good key involving these species?

I still have the specimen, and as it probably is new for Norway it should be verified by an expert. Have you got the possibility to do this?

Tomas


Offline Lars Friman

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #6 on: May 01, 2014, 05:40:40 PM »
Moin Tomas,
Ja jag kan göra det. Min adress är (skiv mig en eMail: LF0107@t-online.de).
Jag förstor ochso litet svensk, men bettre finsk eller deutsch/english.
Lars Friman

Offline Kjell Magne Olsen

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #7 on: October 03, 2014, 08:57:22 PM »
Hei.

Kom det noe ut av dette?

Og bare for ordens skyld: dersom det er slik at de finske dyrene skal skifte navn til L. tisciae, så er det høyst sannsynlig at det kun er det samme som vil skje i Norge. Altså at alt vi hittil har kalt L. rupestre egentlig er L. tisciae, og at sistnevnte ikke er noen ny art for Norge, bare et nytt navn for de norske dyrene.

KMO
KMO

Offline Lars Friman

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2014, 08:39:46 PM »
Moin KNO,

yes it can be so, but it is still possible, that You in Norwegen have still an other
species. We don't know that yet.

Have You checked the norske L. rupestre with DNA-Analysis? I have some
L. tisciae from Finnland (private) und from Eestland (Prof. Olavi Kurina), and
some L. rupestre from the Großglockner-Alps, which I have ID by genital and
which will be investigated soon by the "German Barcode of Life (GBOL) by DNA-
analysis.

Greetings

Lars Friman
  
« Last Edit: October 09, 2014, 08:43:14 PM by Lars Friman »

Offline Kjell Magne Olsen

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #9 on: October 10, 2014, 08:36:03 AM »
But did you check the specimen involved in this topic?

And no, I don't think any Norwegian harvestmen have been tested.
KMO

Offline Tomas Husdal

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #10 on: October 14, 2014, 08:38:46 PM »
Dyret er på vei i posten først nå...

Tomas

Offline Lars Friman

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Re: Vevkjerring
« Reply #11 on: October 15, 2014, 06:45:18 PM »
Moin KNO,

yes I did, but the results are not quit clear. This can be so because

1) the samples can be contaminated/bad or

2) the ID was not correct.

to tab.1.: As You can see in the tab.1 there seems to be two mistakes:

a) the sample "Opilio canestrinii" was contaminated, which is now controlled
    by the original picture of the specimen.

b) the genus Astrobunus (which also belongs to the fam. Sclerosomatidae)
    should not (a.m.o.) stay here?

to tab. 2.: After I have corrected the two obvious mistakes in the tab. 1. ("a" and "b"),
    we get a rather good hypothese for the contakts in the genus Leiobunum.

1) the species L. tisciae, L. rupestre and L. limbatum are near to each other

2) the species L. blackwalli seems to be OK

3) the species L. rotundum (3a) seems to be OK, but the position of L. sp. A (3b) is
    not clear (not enough specimens has been ID-ed?)

4) the species L. limbatum and L. rupestre are again together (! obs. the tab. 2 lies
    a little. The distance between the 1. (upper) and 4. (botom) is due to the graphical
    image (see: 3-2-1-4)!



« Last Edit: October 15, 2014, 06:50:01 PM by Lars Friman »